The Irish Civil War

[jembo]

Wrong. Free State forces during the fighting in Dublin were pro-treaty IRA - recruitment into the new army was restricted to IRA volunteers up to that time. It was after the war had moved on from Dublin that the major expansion of the Free State forces commenced - many recruits, not a majority as indicated above, were veterans of the Great
Believed by who ?

Many of the IRA volunteers were ex soldiers anyway.

That's what Pate we're saying at the time or maybe it was added on later. I remember a discussion somewhere on here, that the Royal Artillery were involved in the training of the gun teams. The sighting, positioning, and firing of these guns is not something that could be learned overnight.

[quinner]

That's what Pate we're saying at the time or maybe it was added on later. I remember a discussion somewhere on here, that the Royal Artillery were involved in the training of the gun teams. The sighting, positioning, and firing of these guns is not something that could be learned overnight.

not doing damage early could have been just to frighten them and get them out......?

[cogito]

Thank you for that.....but, maybe he would ''say that'' for political reasons.....?

Dalton didn't do politics, then or after.

There's no shortage of eyewitness accounts of what occurred in Dublin that week - if you're interested you can look them up.

[quinner]

Dalton didn't do politics, then or after.

There's no shortage of eyewitness accounts of what occurred in Dublin that week - if you're interested you can look them up.

My own Father was a witness to those events, just as my Uncle Jimmy was......

living not a stones throw away they ''seen it all''....

As a you boy I overhead those ''accounts''..many many times...........

'Not a lot of people know that''......

[jembo]

Dalton didn't do politics, then or after.

There's no shortage of eyewitness accounts of what occurred in Dublin that week - if you're interested you can look them up.

I'm sure your right. There was no shortage of volunteers either, the marching columns at the victory parades got longer and fecking longer as the years went by.

[quinner]

I'm sure your right. There was no shortage of volunteers either, the marching columns at the victory parades got longer and fecking longer as the years went by.

Jembo..I had an interesting upbringing......my Uncle was an IRA man (member) all his life....Mam and Dad were Collins' supporters......

I slept in my Uncle's bed as he lived next door and we were overcrowded...The stories I heard in his and when he was around ours (that was every night for supper and bring me up to his place).....Was worth ten published accounts printed for financial gain.......

I even shared his bed when I was on leave from the Army......family loyalty took precedence in our case.....

I believe I mentioned on here before ''I don't read the books because I lived the history of those times'

[jembo]

Dalton was an acting Captain in the Dublin Fusiliers and as an infantry soldier probably would not have had the skills to train artillery gun teams.

[cogito]

Many of the IRA volunteers were ex soldiers anyway.

That's what Pate we're saying at the time or maybe it was added on later. I remember a discussion somewhere on here, that the Royal Artillery were involved in the training of the gun teams. The sighting, positioning, and firing of these guns is not something that could be learned overnight.

There was a report, based on an old man's recollections, of his heavy artillery unit arriving down from the North - lobbing a few shells at the Four Courts - and then mounting up and heading back to the North.

The reports do not stand up to scrutiny.. he may have been confused with a genuine incident where British guns were brought to the border of Fermanagh / Donegal just a few weeks prior to the Civil War where they engaged with pro and anti-treaty IRA who had occupied a small section of Northern Ireland.

The sighting and firing of the guns was learnt overnight - Dalton, though an ex-infantry officer on the Western Front had a small amount of experience with such weaponry - but others with similar expertise were thin on the ground. Twangman's father was one of those who manned the guns at the Four Courts - he discussed the events a few times when he used to post here regularly - there was certainly no mention of any British Army involvement.

Later, when WW1 veterans (officers and NCOs included) arrived into the new Free State army they brought considerable specialist knowledge with them - which assisted with the relative speed in the defeat of the anti-treaty forces during the conventional phase of the war.

[DAMNTHEWEATHER]

Emmet Dalton did the 'training' - he showed them how to load, aim and fire the field guns in the general direction of the Four Courts - it still took them three days and nights to knock a proper hole in it.

They were using the wrong shells.

[cogito]

They were using the wrong shells.

Armour piercing... they'd run out of high explosive.

[DAMNTHEWEATHER]

not doing damage early could have been just to frighten them and get them out......?

The wrong ammo was the bogey....later the Brits allowed them the right shells....and they broke through.

[quinner]

The wrong ammo was the bogey....later the Brits allowed them the right shells....and they broke through.

So it has been said......but, not by my sources......

[DAMNTHEWEATHER]

Armour piercing... they'd run out of high explosive.

NO... they had been supplied with 'shrapnel' shells which were useless....after much hassle the Brits gave in to a certain number of 'high explosive' shells only..... The fear being if it all went wrong the shells might be used against the Brits. As it was McCready's gang in the Royal Hospital got a few bits an pieces their way by mistake. One gun was trying to use the field gun as a rifle ffs.

[DAMNTHEWEATHER]

So it has been said......but, not by my sources......

The man in the street was heard to tell tall tales of what he overheard or thought he saw....wild claims abounded at the time....exaggeration was all the rage......Just like the old fisherman story. We must give most credence to those who were at the coal face .....and those who interviewed those who were at the coal face to get nearest the truth..... You will not like that....but the truth sometimes hurts.

[quinner]

The man in the street was heard to tell tall tales of what he overheard or thought he saw....wild claims abounded at the time....exaggeration was all the rage......Just like the old fisherman story. We must give most credence to those who were at the coal face .....and those who interviewed those who were at the coal face to get nearest the truth..... You will not like that....but the truth sometimes hurts.

Yes, I have seen you get annoyed many times......

I never saw my uncle who took part in the Civil-war get annoyed.....about the truth........